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jess
05-11-2015, 05:24 PM
I know they've been discontinued but I'm hoping that someone here might know of another supplier or substitution for the old Cheater D's. I want to change the strap on my Imago to either an Absolute strap or a QAM strap but would love to have the option of using the same strap on other bags with the clip. Any advice is appreciated, thanks!

adalangdon
05-11-2015, 07:32 PM
See this thread (http://forums.tombihn.com/general-bag-discussion/9065-using-absolute-shoulder-strap-old-id.html)-- a place called John Howard has them-- but it looks like you will have to buy and sew on the webbing yourself...

jess
05-12-2015, 05:55 AM
See this thread (http://forums.tombihn.com/general-bag-discussion/9065-using-absolute-shoulder-strap-old-id.html)-- a place called John Howard has them-- but it looks like you will have to buy and sew on the webbing yourself...

Thanks! I do have a sewing machine that is sadly ignored hmm….

moriond
05-12-2015, 07:30 AM
I know they've been discontinued but I'm hoping that someone here might know of another supplier or substitution for the old Cheater D's. I want to change the strap on my Imago to either an Absolute strap or a QAM strap but would love to have the option of using the same strap on other bags with the clip. Any advice is appreciated, thanks!

Hi @jess,

I'm surprised because the Imago was made late enough so that you shouldn't need to use "Cheater D" ring adapters. If you have the first generation Imago (which I'm pretty sure is not the case), the strap on one side is sewn on, like the Small and Medium size Cafe Bags. In the redesigned version, you should just be able to thread a Q-AM or Absolute strap (with the hook ends removed) through the toothed slides attached to the sides of the bag, The only reason that older ID bags, Super Egos, and Egos need the "Cheater D" adapter is because they were made with 2" wide straps, and the Absolute Strap, etc. are 1.5" wide, so can't be threaded through directly into the 2" wide toothed slides and hold securely. But that's not the case with the Imagos, which are slimmer bags, and always had compatibly sized shoulder strap widths.

For the current Large Cafe Bag, the only reason for using Cheater D ring adapters is if you're not willing to leave an Absolute strap threaded through the toothed slides at the ends, and want to be able to clip and unclip an Absolute Strap (e.g., the same one you use to carry much heavier luggage bags) to the LCB.

Which Imago do you want to change the strap on?

moriond

jess
05-12-2015, 07:39 AM
I have the Imago that I can thread the strap through--I just wanted to be able to use the same strap with my WF since I don't need it all the time. I was trying to be good and buy less stuff. I should really know better ;)

moriond
05-12-2015, 08:43 AM
Well, being able to switch off an Absolute Strap is a valid reason for wanting to use the Cheater D ring adapters. I'd only do this for the Absolute Strap, since the Q-AM strap doesn't usually come with the end clips, although @tpnl has hacked using this strap with end clips for his Pilot, My favorite strap for the Imago is the Q-AM, because this bag and my typical load init is not so large that I need to use an Absolute Strap, and the long, padded nylon covered length of the Q-AM strap works to distribute the weight of the contents, but still make it easy to shift/swing the bag around while I'm wearing it to easily access the contents. (The grippy under surface of the Absolute Strap is great for making sure that heavy loads don't slip when on your shoulder, but you also can't swing the bag around as easily to access under the flap while carrying.).

I'm using it for this easy-access, swing around purpose rather than for trying to carry the imago high up on my back, which may be another reason you'd use the Q-AM strap -- if you were riding a bike, or carrying much larger bags like the Ego or Super Ego. I could manage an Ego, though this is a bit large for me; @adalangdon has a picture showing how the Ego looks worn on her back. I'm guessing that I'd have to be at least 5'8" tall, or have a much bigger frame to try to carry off a Super Ego. Not everyone likes the Q-AM strap, though. It turns out that the Q-AM strap is also more comfortable for me to use with Parental Unit with one big caveat: the strap has to be "worn in" from use. The new Q-AM straps are too stiff to be comfortable for me carried across the wider endpoints of the PU, but if I shift over to the Q-AM strap that I've worn for some time with an Imago, then that strap is more comfortable for me with the PU than the Absolute strap. Otherwise, at my height/frame (e.g., if you wear petite clothing), an Absolute Strap (new or used) is more comfortable with the PU than a new Q-AM strap. Again, I suspect that taller, larger people won't need as much curvature in the Q-AM strap with the PU at the shoulder point to find this strap comfortable, so the difference between using a new vs. "worn in" Q-AM won't be so marked for them. It sure is with me. With the Imago, wearing a new Q-AM strap takes a little initial adjustment to find the most comfortable carrying position and strap length, but it's not like the experience of a new Q-AM strap with the Parental Unit, because the closer together endpoints of the Imago compared to the PU will naturally make the strap flex more into a comfortable position, Just my experience, YMMV.

If you do make your own "Cheater D" with the Beastee Dee® - John Howard Company, Inc. (http://www.johnhowardcompany.com/Beastee%20Dee.htm) adapters, you'll need to get some short 1.5" webbing to loop through them, and then tack down the ends so they won't slip through the toothed slide.

HTH

moriond

terayon
05-12-2015, 06:08 PM
One other reason one might want the cheater Ds is because the metal snap hooks swivel, so you can just grab the strap in the proper orientation and the ends will untwist themselves. This, to me, is a gigantic plus.

jess
05-12-2015, 06:41 PM
Well, being able to switch off an Absolute Strap is a valid reason for wanting to use the Cheater D ring adapters. I'd only do this for the Absolute Strap, since the Q-AM strap doesn't usually come with the end clips, although @tpnl has hacked using this strap with end clips for his Pilot, My favorite strap for the Imago is the Q-AM, because this bag and my typical load init is not so large that I need to use an Absolute Strap, and the long, padded nylon covered length of the Q-AM strap works to distribute the weight of the contents, but still make it easy to shift/swing the bag around while I'm wearing it to easily access the contents. (The grippy under surface of the Absolute Strap is great for making sure that heavy loads don't slip when on your shoulder, but you also can't swing the bag around as easily to access under the flap while carrying.).

I'm using it for this easy-access, swing around purpose rather than for trying to carry the imago high up on my back, which may be another reason you'd use the Q-AM strap -- if you were riding a bike, or carrying much larger bags like the Ego or Super Ego. I could manage an Ego, though this is a bit large for me; @adalangdon has a picture showing how the Ego looks worn on her back. I'm guessing that I'd have to be at least 5'8" tall, or have a much bigger frame to try to carry off a Super Ego. Not everyone likes the Q-AM strap, though. It turns out that the Q-AM strap is also more comfortable for me to use with Parental Unit with one big caveat: the strap has to be "worn in" from use. The new Q-AM straps are too stiff to be comfortable for me carried across the wider endpoints of the PU, but if I shift over to the Q-AM strap that I've worn for some time with an Imago, then that strap is more comfortable for me with the PU than the Absolute strap. Otherwise, at my height/frame (e.g., if you wear petite clothing), an Absolute Strap (new or used) is more comfortable with the PU than a new Q-AM strap. Again, I suspect that taller, larger people won't need as much curvature in the Q-AM strap with the PU at the shoulder point to find this strap comfortable, so the difference between using a new vs. "worn in" Q-AM won't be so marked for them. It sure is with me. With the Imago, wearing a new Q-AM strap takes a little initial adjustment to find the most comfortable carrying position and strap length, but it's not like the experience of a new Q-AM strap with the Parental Unit, because the closer together endpoints of the Imago compared to the PU will naturally make the strap flex more into a comfortable position, Just my experience, YMMV.

If you do make your own "Cheater D" with the Beastee Dee® - John Howard Company, Inc. (http://www.johnhowardcompany.com/Beastee%20Dee.htm) adapters, you'll need to get some short 1.5" webbing to loop through them, and then tack down the ends so they won't slip through the toothed slide.

HTH

moriond

You're always such a help! Thanks. You've given me a fair amount to consider. From your description, the QAM might be more of what I'm looking for.

tpnl
05-31-2015, 10:00 PM
I found a site that does sell something that is the closest equivalent to a cheater-D adapter I have found so far:

Double D-Ring Straps (http://www.strapworks.com/category_s/665.htm)

What I like best is that they have different widths of webbing and a choice of what "ring" you want.

The result might be similar to @Spydermann's post:

Ego and the Absolute Strap Hack (http://forums.tombihn.com/photos-videos-and-reviews/6144-ego-absolute-strap-hack.html?highlight=absolute+shoulder+strap)

I also think this would be a good solution for those people with 2" straps on their Super Ego, etc. They could get the 2" webbing version of the above Double D-Ring Strap and then hook on an Absolute Shoulder Strap or a modified Q-AM shoulder strap that uses Snaphooks (use a tri-glide buckle and wrap the webbing through it, then through the TB snaphook and back again though the tri-glide).

Also, if you just buy the parts, you could make one yourself with a bit of sewing and the right width of webbing.

Hope this helps

Cheers!

moriond
05-24-2016, 03:15 PM
Hi All,

I thought I'd update this thread with a link to @tpnl's latest solution for modifying bags that use webbing straps threaded through toothed slides, like the old Imago, Ego, Super Ego, and ID Messenger Bags. It should also work as a hack for converting the older style large cafe bags with the webbing loops at each side to using snap hooks.

This was prompted by a recent post that @jess made over on the Ravelry forums, where she restated her desire, expressed in the original post of this thread, to be able to switch straps with snaphook ends onto her Imago. It also seems timely, because the large cafe bag and the Parental Unit have switched over or are in the process of switching over to D-ring attachment points for snaphooks. See, for example the pictures in my post (https://forums.tombihn.com/questions-about-bags/11135-large-cafe-bag-stabilizer-strap-post125792.html#post125792) of a few days ago in the Large Cafe bag with stabilizer strap? (https://forums.tombihn.com/questions-about-bags/11135-large-cafe-bag-stabilizer-strap.html) thread.

Specifically, I wanted to point people to @tpnl's post (https://forums.tombihn.com/questions-about-bags/10268-super-ego-shoulder-strap-question-post111101.html#post111101) in the Super Ego Shoulder strap question (https://forums.tombihn.com/questions-about-bags/10268-super-ego-shoulder-strap-question-post111101.html) thread. This method does work for hacking the Imago (and the older Large Cafe Bag) to accept a strap with snap hooks, just by the use of a pair of 1.5" Triangle Clips. It's not as neat as using the discontinued "Cheater D-Rings" that we used to be able to order from Parts in both the 1.5" and 2" sizes. Note that people who have really old model ID bags, Egos, and Super Egos have different size (wider) webbing straps, hence the point of @tpnl's questions to the original poster/owner of a Super Ego in the linked thread, before giving a detailed answer.

I personally will not use this hack to modify any bags for which I routinely use a Quick-Adjust Messenger Strap, so I've only checked that it works in order to answer @jess's question. The reason is that introducing a hinged break where the snap hook connects to the bag in place of the continuous connection through the webbing, makes it less easy to swing the bag into different positions. It's less noticeable if you are carrying more weight in your bags, but I definitely notice the difference in performance in ease of pulling around my Imago into different positions if I change the Q-AM strap to add snaphook ends, and change the connection points, And if I didn't notice the difference, why would I be buying into Tom's designs in the first place? Just my 2˘.

HTH

moriond

ETA: The pair of 1.5" triangle clips (https://www.tombihn.com/collections/accessories/products/parts?variant=16645156935) can be ordered from the Parts page of Accessories.

threeteez
05-24-2016, 05:36 PM
Thanks, moriond. I've added a pair of the triangle clips to my wish list for when I next order something. I'll try the hack with my Op/Tech mini-SOS strap on an Imago. I typically don't load a lot, have to carry it far and I'm not bothered by the regular non-swivel strap but it's nice to have options especially since the Imago is my keep-forever, favorite bag.

Jenne
05-25-2016, 06:54 AM
... it's nice to have options especially since the Imago is my keep-forever, favorite bag.

I feel the same way about my Imago (which was either my first or second TB bag, the other being an MCB.) Never thought about modifying it, though!