525 Ballistic is evolving...to 630?

[ittoujuu]

A couple weeks ago, when browsing through color options on the page for some bag or other, I noticed that the listings for the 525 Ballistic color now read as just "[color] Ballistic," while the 1050 and 210 types kept the denier number. At the time, I didn't think much of it - perhaps just a confirmation that TB saw the mid-weight ballistic nylon as its "default" offering.

But then, as I was reading over the materials page last weekend, I saw this tidbit in the 525 Ballistic section:

"A note about the denier: we are beginning a transition from our 525d ballistic nylon to 630d ballistic nylon. They’re virtually the same fabrics — both high-tenacity yarns and even though 630d is ever so slightly heavier on paper, we can hardly feel it. 30d will offer us a continuously available supply (the base yarns will continue to be stocked by our mill) at an ever-so-slightly increased cost."

Because there was already a 630 Recycled Nylon, I was curious about this switch-over. Each different fabric has colors specific to that fabric (and the 630 Recycled Nylon is no exception to that), but in this case, it sounds as though this new 630 will come in all the colors that 525 had, and so the transition will be pretty smooth. I am curious, though, about the reason for the changeover. Is there some sort of material advantage in that extra 105 Ds, or is this mainly a case of working around material/supply chain hitches? And how does this 630 compare to the recycled 630? My big hope is that this will somehow magically solve the unfortunate scuffing-with-light-use issue that I've witnessed a number of times in photos here, but that may be a bit of wishful thinking on my part. Still, as someone who tends to favor beefier fabrics, I'm totally in favor of a slightly heavier variant of the middleweight offering.

[dirkhaun]

All I know is that the switch to 630 was announced as a side note in a blog post on March 31. That post makes it sound like it's at least in part to address supply issues.

Also, from my understanding, 630 Recycled is softer than 525 due to the 50% recycled fabric whereas "pure" 630 should be at least as sturdy as 525.

[John1970]

I wish they would distinguish on the website between 525 and 630. I'm holding out for the 630 in hopes that it resolves the scuffing issue, or at least reduces it.

[Tonya]

Hmmm the quote "at an ever-so-slightly increased cost" has me slightly concerned. I assume that this is an additional cost increase that's separate from the May increase? I'm not really surprised. The cost of everything seems to be rising through the roof. I'm just grateful that TB is doing what they can to keep costs down while still sourcing materials and producing quality bags.

[MikeV]

Hi all- I'll offer a couple points of clarification here.

525d Ballistic > 630d Ballistic transition: this is an in-line, rolling change. As we run out of the 525, we'll transition to 630. The two fabrics are the same construction and same coating, just slightly larger denier yarn. The change is being driven by sourcing needs. The hand of the fabric is very similar, as is the results of our internal testing. It's likely folks who know 525 really well will recognize a slight difference but just as likely some folks won't feel it at all.

With regards the the 630 ballistic and 630 recycled- dirkhaun is correct- the two fabrics are different altogether and the 630/525 ballistic is considerably heavier than the 630 recycled. And the slight price increase on the fabric was brought into consideration for the price increase earlier this year- no additional price increases for the immediate future.

I hope that all helps!

[ittoujuu]

Thanks for the official explanations, MikeV. I was never actually clear on what, exactly, the recycled 630 is from a material standpoint, or where it stands in comparison to the other fabrics you offer. Until now, I'd thought of it as a close cousin of 525 ballistic, but it sounds like the differences are more pronounced than that. It sounds that, as far as mid-weight ballistic is concerned, 630 and 525 ballistic are functionally interchangeable, so I suppose we can just regard it as such (and probably why the "525" was removed from the drop-down menus and those offerings are just now regarded as "Ballistic"). Just as long as you guys keep Wilderness in stock... :P

[Perseffect]

Is it possible to confirm if the 630 will handle the scuff marks better than 525? I’ve really tried to avoid 525 due to this issue in the past. Thanks

[moriond]

Is it possible to confirm if the 630 will handle the scuff marks better than 525? I’ve really tried to avoid 525 due to this issue in the past. Thanks

From MikeV ‘s statements I think the 630d Ballistic Nylon will wear very similarly to the 525d Ballistic Nylon, since the scuff behavior is determined by the coating deposition on the fabric, which is similar, and not by the slightly heavier weight of the fiber weave.

[kurt]

Now that the 630 has had some time to run -- anyone get 630 and find it did or didn't scuff like the 525?

[G42]

Now that the 630 has had some time to run -- anyone get 630 and find it did or didn't scuff like the 525?

Note that it was a soft conversion (that's why the 525 designation dropped), so it's very possible people may not know if they have 525 or 630, depending on what bag/colorway/purchase date, restocks, etc

[kurt]

Note that it was a soft conversion (that's why the 525 designation dropped), so it's very possible people may not know if they have 525 or 630, depending on what bag/colorway/purchase date, restocks, etc

Yup! Though for anyone wondering: I emailed them and they told me the factory is out (or close to out) of 525, so as I understand it: *probably* anything 'new' at this point (by which I mean: things that are preordered, or recently restocked) is going to be 630 (including the NFTDs, which is specifically what I was curious about, because I just got mine!).

[G42]

Yup! Though for anyone wondering: I emailed them and they told me the factory is out (or close to out) of 525, so as I understand it: *probably* anything 'new' at this point (by which I mean: things that are preordered, or recently restocked) is going to be 630 (including the NFTDs, which is specifically what I was curious about, because I just got mine!).

I ordered the Black/Cloud/Dusk NFTD and interestingly it might be 525 Cloud since MatthewR had mentioned here that Cloud was probably the last 525 standing and that's just before the NFTDs orders were going in

https://forums.tombihn.com/forum/tom-bihn-forums/questions-about-bags/348356-double-ballistic-bags?p=348385#post348385

I have a Cloud Pop Tote in 525 and don't notice it particularly scuffing how I use it, but I do notice that the bottom shows dirt more (and there could be scuffs under that dirt, who knows) because of how light the colour is, so I really liked the option of a NFTD with black on the base to hide any dirt (plane floors are just filthy)/ lighter Cloud on top. And it's just really really calm with Dusk on the inside.