Welcome!

We're glad you are here. This is the place to ask for bag advice, help other people out, post reviews, and share photos and videos.

TOM BIHN Forums Statistics

Collapse
Topics: 15,029   Posts: 194,206   Members: 6,939   Active Members: 205
Welcome to our newest member, aubreyand.

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Synapse 25 delamination

Collapse
X
Collapse
 
  • Page of 1
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
Previous template Next
    #1

    Synapse 25 delamination

    I've used a Synapse 25L halcyon/halcyon for a few years for my commute and eventually noticed that water would get in at the top of the bag on slightly rainy-er days. After checking, I noticed that the under side of the external halcyon fabric delaminated and thus lost it's waterproofness or repellency capabilities. Note: AFAIK this bag was never sold as "water proof" or "repellent", though it does have water repellent YKK zippers and halcyon is pretty much waterproof until the delamination happens.

    I just wanted to share this around for people doing the same kind of thing, or see if there's any feedback from TB or anyone else really. I suspect I asked a little too much from this type of fabric and the halcyon is still in good shape on the outside. Would definitely think about buying an updated version if it had a more permanent method of applying the fabric backing (I'm not sure how that's called, but I assume this is basically some light polyurethane glue or similar) - because waterproof bag covers are never perfect and water always gets in a little bit (specially on a bike in the storm, which tends to happen where I live)
    1 Photo
    Tags: None
    • Likes 3
    #2

    I think they're mostly described as 'water resistant' and yes, the eventual delamination/wear of the coating is a known aspect of the material (not just TB) - it just wears over time.

    Check out the Nik Wax to see if you want to treat the bag... You can Google around, it's used all over for retreating outdoor fabrics

    https://www.tombihn.com/products/nik...nt=16645280455


    When I'm in heavy actual rain, regardless of how well the DWR is holding up, I add a pack cover, like on my recent hikes with the Paragon in Olympic National Park. I used an REI exterior cover.


    ETA, I was inside out, its DWR outside and urethane inside
    The coatings section within the materials glossary has a much better write up then my fumbling attempt https://www.tombihn.com/pages/materials
    Last edited by G42; 11-24-2022, 04:00 AM.
    “Commander, I always used to consider that you had a definite anti-authoritarian streak in you.”
    “Sir?”
    “It seems that you have managed to retain this even though you are authority.”
    “Sir?”
    “That’s practically zen.”
    -Terry Pratchett, Feet of Clay
    ​
    • Likes 2

    Comment

      #3
      I did have that happen with my Synapse 19 after . . . less than a decade? more than five years? of use. It only happened near the top of the bag within a few inches of the zipper, like your picture shows. It's actually why I haven't had the zippers replaced on that bag, since I'm afraid the fabric would get even more worn out from that repair. The light/thinner water-resistant coating just wears out/through faster than the thicker version which is on the ballistic fabrics.

      G42 Which REI rain covers have you used? I've looked at the ones from REI and Osprey and am not sure which sizes would work.
      • Likes 1

      Comment

        #4
        For a long time I had a Sea to Summit cover and it's packed with my emergency kit right now I think.

        Since I knew I would be hiking in rain on the Olympic Peninsula, I bought an REI XS cover so that I could leave the other with my ekit.

        They're designed to fit a range of sizes and have a cinch cord to tighten. It's still a bit loose but perfectly fine for actually preventing rain from getting in.

        ETA, since its adjustable, it fits many of my packs

        https://www.rei.com/product/168261/r...-rain-cover-xs
        Last edited by G42; 11-17-2022, 07:40 AM.
        “Commander, I always used to consider that you had a definite anti-authoritarian streak in you.”
        “Sir?”
        “It seems that you have managed to retain this even though you are authority.”
        “Sir?”
        “That’s practically zen.”
        -Terry Pratchett, Feet of Clay
        ​
        • Likes 2

        Comment

          #5
          As per my original comment I do absolutely use a pack cover I also know of so-called DWRs but as we all know it's not all that durable haha. It does work though. It would be interesting to consider this in future bag designs though, the water always eventually makes it way at the edges of the rain cover. For my on the Synapse its always (and only) at the top of the bag (makes sense) if its particularly bad weather and I'm biking (if you think about it when you go down on the bars of the bike this area is very exposed with wind and water) - usually not really happening in light rain/etc.

          Quite a specific thing i know, but definitely one of the reasons why I picked this up originally (I knew the fabric laminate stuff on the back would make it more waterproof than average without needing a full-on waterproof bag).

          Note: I also owned this bag for "less than a decade and i think more than 5 years" I still use it all the time, its a really nice bag.
          • Likes 1

          Comment

            #6
            jimmy Yeah, there's that line between committing to a full on waterproof item and something that is good enough for normal mixed use, especially if you're not out in soaking rain all the time.

            If you haven't seen it, TB is going to use X-Pac for the first time on the new Addax family and they had a nice blog post about the material, including the water repellency and one comment says the next bags up are Syniks.

            https://www.tombihn.com/blogs/main/w...excited-for-it


            ETA:

            And I added a comment to my previous post that I'm wrong and inside out... DWR outside/urethane inside... Still unfortunately a known common wear item for the fabric
            (thanks eris )

            The coatings section within the materials glossary has more info

            Materials
            https://www.tombihn.com/pages/materials#coatings
            TOM BIHN has been using the highest quality materials for our packs and bags for over three decades.
            Last edited by G42; 11-24-2022, 04:34 AM.
            “Commander, I always used to consider that you had a definite anti-authoritarian streak in you.”
            “Sir?”
            “It seems that you have managed to retain this even though you are authority.”
            “Sir?”
            “That’s practically zen.”
            -Terry Pratchett, Feet of Clay
            ​
            • Likes 1

            Comment

            Previous template Next
            Working...
            X