John Ball's Steel Dyneema Aeronaut:

[ykang2375]

I was watching the Tom Bihn's fabrics video and noticed something odd about John Ball's Steel Dyneema Aeronaut bag: Innovation in Fabrics - YouTube

The rubber cover over the zippers appeared to be shiny instead of the nice matte finish. Do they start to get shiny due to age?

Any insight would be helpful. Also, any tips for long term shortage of TB 1050d bags?

Thanks!!

[Moose]

My S25 zippers have always has a matte looking finish. All my Kits are shiny as shiny can be. My Western Flyer and Tri Star are matte as are are my other accessory bags. I have seen no change in any of them over time. Part of what we see in the video could be lighting. Maybe they were trying out/test driving new zipper material and that bag is a prototype. That's the best I can come up with.
Moose

[ykang2375]

My S25 zippers have always has a matte looking finish. All my Kits are shiny as shiny can be. My Western Flyer and Tri Star are matte as are are my other accessory bags. I have seen no change in any of them over time. Part of what we see in the video could be lighting. Maybe they were trying out/test driving new zipper material and that bag is a prototype. That's the best I can come up with.
Moose

Thanks for the reply Moose, I appreciate it!! Good guess, I hope it was only a prototype, that shiny zipper made the bag look really tacky. I love TB bags just the way they are. Extremely well made and classy looking.

[spamjam]

Your now non-angst might be short-lived as the Aquaguard zippers are now being installed reversed from the previous method, i.e., now the "correct" side out, at least for some items. This was mentioned in the Pilot introduction in the forums (http://forums.tombihn.com/tom-bihn-n...html#post56699). Relevant portion copied here for your reading pleasure...

It's here: the Pilot
One of the first things you might notice is the change in the look of the Pilot's YKK Aquaguard splash-proof zippers. Here's the scoop:

For over ten years, we've made extensive use of YKK's Aquaguard splash-proof zippers. These zippers have added a degree of water repellency to the closures on our bags that before we could only dream of.

As you've probably come to expect, we aren't inclined to leave well enough alone, and we've been experimenting with different ways in which to sew Aquaguard zippers into our bags. The industry standard has been to sew splash-proof zippers effectively "upside-down", so that the teeth of the zipper end up inside the bag, and the urethane coating is on the outside. This creates the look that people have come to associate with so called "waterproof" zippers (you'll find many bags these days have zippers sewn "upside-down" so that they look as if they're splash-proof zippers when in fact they're just regular zippers sewn that way.)

And also as you've probably come to expect, just because everyone else does it a certain way, doesn't mean we will. First motivated by our desire to reduce the weight of our bags when and where possible, we realized that, if we sew the zippers right side up, we are able to save a bit of weight because we can utilize the woven edge of the zipper tape to finish the zipper seam, rather than adding binding tape as we did before. And when we made samples of the Aeronaut, Pilot, and other bags with the YKK Aquaguard splash-proof zippers sewn right-side up, we took note of how how much we liked the looks of them.

Sewing the Aquaguard zipper in right-side-up (or "teeth-side-out") also overcomes a minor disadvantages to sewing it in upside-down: mainly, the urethane coating on the zipper is no longer exposed to the elements and abrasion. We've found that when we sew the Aquaguard zipper up-side-down (coating exposed), there was occasional, minor shredding of the urethane itself, resulting in a minor change to the aesthetic though not impacting the splash-proofness of the zipper. Sewing the Aquaguard zippers in the same way as we would sew in regular zippers, right side up, puts the urethane coating inside the bag where it's protected, and also allows the teeth to expand, rather than compress, as the zipper rounds corners. Does it affect the water repellency? Nope.

[ykang2375]

Your now non-angst might be short-lived as the Aquaguard zippers are now being installed reversed from the previous method, i.e., now the "correct" side out, at least for some items. This was mentioned in the Pilot introduction in the forums (http://forums.tombihn.com/tom-bihn-n...html#post56699). Relevant portion copied here for your reading pleasure...

Hey Spamjam, thanks for the update regarding the new way Aquaguard zipper might be placed going forward. I took a look at the Pilot and Co-Pilot's new zippers and it's not too bad. I can definitely see the advantage of sewing them that way. I meant that John Ball's Aeronaut bag's zipper was oriented in the old way (tape exposed) but that it was very shiny instead of the normal matte finish, it just made the bag look odd. As Moose had mentioned it may have just been a prototype they were working on. I much prefer the Co-Pilot/Pilot zipper style, probably eliminates the shredding issue of the external tape over the zippers. I take it pretty easy on my TB Tri-Star so I'm not too worried about the shredding issue. I'm sure my Tri-Star will last a very long time and I'm definitely a customer for life.

[WisBags]

This is just my speculation, but after receiving a new Pilot, I noticed the Aquaguard zippers are not simply the old ones flipped, they are different. They rubber portion is now shiny and not matte. It appears to me this Aeronaut was built with the new zipper.

[ykang2375]

This is just my speculation, but after receiving a new Pilot, I noticed the Aquaguard zippers are not simply the old ones flipped, they are different. They rubber portion is now shiny and not matte. It appears to me this Aeronaut was built with the new zipper.

Thanks for the reply WisBags, I don't really mind the new zipper orientation. Just curious, do you have a picture of the inside of the Pilot? I'm guessing it doesn't matter what the tape looks like because its in the inside of the bag now. Right?

[WisBags]

I don't like it as much for two reasons. One, it seems cheaper for lack of a better word. It is on the inside, so not really seen, however. Two, the Pilot has two stitch lines on both sides of every zipper. The co-pilot (at least until the zipper change) does not have any stitches on the outside of the bag, giving it a more premium feel. I'm not all that excited about the prospect of all the aquaguard zippers being flipped in this manner and stitches being visible.

[ykang2375]

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I don't like it as much for two reasons. One, it seems cheaper for lack of a better word. It is on the inside, so not really seen, however. Two, the Pilot has two stitch lines on both sides of every zipper. The co-pilot (at least until the zipper change) does not have any stitches on the outside of the bag, giving it a more premium feel. I'm not all that excited about the prospect of all the aquaguard zippers being flipped in this manner and stitches being visible.

Hey WisBags, thanks for the picture. I tend to agree with you, I'm not a huge fan of the reversed zippers. The exposed tape was kind of a TB signature. I kind of curious of what the Tri-Star or Aeronaut will look like with the new zippers. Maybe someone should start a poll about it.

Thanks again!

[chrisc983]

John Ball's Steel Dyneema Aeronaut:

I wonder what the difference between the gloss and the matte finish aquaguard zippers are? Does one offer better water protection that the other? Or is one more reliable that the other? Or are they the same and just a different finish on them?

[Moose]

For what it's worth, the matt fabric seems (to me anyway) a bit more flexible than the shiny.

[BarryLee]

I believe some customers had an issue with wear on the old zippers that sometimes resulted in the gasket material being shredding and looking pretty bad. Comparing the new zippers on my Pilot to the older ones on my Co-pilot I suspect the new ones will hold up much better. So, while the new zippers don’t have the visual appeal of the previous zipper in the long run they’re probably a better choice.

[ykang2375]

I believe some customers had an issue with wear on the old zippers that sometimes resulted in the gasket material being shredding and looking pretty bad. Comparing the new zippers on my Pilot to the older ones on my Co-pilot I suspect the new ones will hold up much better. So, while the new zippers don’t have the visual appeal of the previous zipper in the long run they’re probably a better choice.

Hey BarryLee, I tend to agree with you regarding the visual appeal of the reversed zipper vs. long-term durability. I'm curious to see how it will look on the Aeronaut and the Tri-Star. I doubt TB would allow anything to compromise the overall look or durability of their bags.